Pick Up Stix:

Drums and discipline will set you free


ÒIÕll look out into the crowd, at the dude in the far back, and think
about all the shows IÕve seen and what it took to get there,
and IÕll say to myself, ÔWhatever you do, remember
this moment, because youÕre here.ÕÓ
ÐÐ Jason Sutter






From the small town of Potsdam, New York, to a stadium nearest you comes a drummer ready to rock with a wildly diverse tribe of musical masters. Jason Sutter is his name, a man whoÕs lent his touring and recording chops ÐÐ and winning go-for-it attitude ÐÐ to the likes of Chris Cornell, Vertical Horizon, Foreigner, Pink, the New York Dolls and currently Marilyn Manson.

Sutter worked hard at his craft to get where he is today, which happens to be sipping iced tea by the pool at his art-filled house in North Hollywood, California. Fully prepared in the fundamentals of a wide variety of drumming styles and techniques, the affable Sutter was ready to strike when the iron got hot, and today is supremely grateful for his good fortune ÐÐ which even to him seems larger than real life.

ÒI donÕt ever, ever take it for granted,Ó he says. ÒWith the New York Dolls, I savored every second I was onstage with one of my favorite bands ever. And to play these gigs with Marilyn Manson? HeÕs climbing the drum riser, screaming in my face, and IÕm looking at him going, ÔIÕm playing with Marilyn Manson, itÕs insane. ItÕs like, This is fucking crazy.ÕÓ


FIRST WE LOOK TO DER VATER

JasonÕs dad was an artist and professor at the local Potsdam university ÐÐ but what he really wanted to do was play the drums. He and JasonÕs mom raised the kid and his sister in this small community that was kind of different, says Jason, because there were four colleges in town, and a lot of bars. So when Sutter was growing up there in the Ô80s, there were tons of live venues, and live bands ruled the day.

Eventually liÕl Jason himself got to play in those bars, and was able to see the real dudes playing with the real gear and the real amps and speakers and trucks loading their gear, and all that righteous stuff.

ÒSo at a super young age I was seeing really great professional acts,Ó he says. ÒI still feel like cover bands in the Ô80s were as professional as the professional bands. They were just so pro and so good.Ó

To Jason, these local players were genuine rock stars whose performances and, really, mere presence in town would inspire kids like himself to run back to their bedrooms and practice.

ÒIt also gave us a pretty clear blueprint of how we could do it on a smaller level, like high schools, and grade schools ÐÐ my first gig was in fifth grade, at a dance. We were playing Rolling Stones tunes, and we knew we could make Ôem sound good ÐÐ unlike other bands that were trying to play Journey or something and failing miserably at it.Ó

There was a great music store there in Potsdam, too, and most of SutterÕs teachers in grade school and high school were grads of the local CraneÕs School of Music. At CraneÕs this guy named Jim Peterzak was one of JasonÕs mentors; Peterzak went on to teach Dave Weckl and Vinnie Colaiuta and other biggie drummers. At CraneÕs Jason started to learn to read music, and by fourth grade he was accompanying the choir, thrown in by the music director, whoÕd taught Jason a basic rock beat.

ÒNext thing you know heÕs playing piano, with a bass player whoÕs probably in fifth grade, and IÕm playing a real straight beat, and learned very quickly how to accompany ÐÐ and get out of the way.Ó

As soon as Jason learned how to play a beat, he was gigging, playing his first bar gig when I was 13.

ÒAnd my mom was fine with it,Ó he says. ÒIÕd get home at 3 in the morning and go to bed with my ears ringing.Ó

For Jason it was drums, just drums, and nothing else that pricked his ears.

ÒI went to music school and studied piano and ear training and sight singing and all these things, but I never cared about any other instruments. I never went over and was, like, trying to pick up a dudeÕs guitar or bass after rehearsal ÐÐ they all wanted to get on my drums, always.Ó


BONHAM BRILLIANCE
Jason SutterÕs got roots in a lotta different styles, but even as a kid, he knew: I am a rocker. He could relate.

ÒWhen I first started playing in '78-'79, John Bonham died. Well, all they did was play Bonham on the radio for like two months straight, and I would just record everything. Within a couple of weeks I had every Led Zep record there ever was. That changed everything.Ó

Sure, drummers from here to Ougadougu cite BonhamÕs enormous influence on rock tubwhacking stylee. SutterÕs no exception.

ÒThere was an attitude,Ó he says. ÒJohn Bonham was never perfect, never too clean, but he had something like raw power, heart and passion. It was just so undeniable.Ó

Trying to re-create that Bonham feel is easier said than done. The key, says Sutter, is in where each drum in the set is placed, most notably the hi-hat.

ÒEveryone always talks about BonhamÕs big bass drum and how hard he hit and all these things, but itÕs a lot more subtle than that. Listen to the way he played the hi-hat in beats like ÔFool in the RainÕ or ÔWhen the Levee Breaks,Õ tracks that people are always trying to figure out. Anyone can play that ÔWhen the Levee BreaksÕ beat on a bass drum and snare and itÕll never sound like Bonham; itÕs when you start getting that distortion on the hi-hat, the way he was swinging it, and the way that related to the bass and the snare drum. If you listen to those recordings, thatÕs the secret.Ó

If you ask Sutter about other drummers he was inspired by, you gotta be prepared for a list that goes on for miles. But itÕs cool, itÕs nice out here by the pool.

ÒI was really influenced very young by OzzyÕs drummer Lee Kerslake, who was super underrated, and then Tommy Eldridge did OzzyÕs live stuff, and itÕs ridiculous, this double-bass playing. Of course Bill Ward with Sabbath for the same reasons ÐÐ heÕs really raw, it was passionate, and it was just so accessible to me.Ó

He singles out Phil Collins as another drummer with a highly individual approach, and a player not generally credited for his wicked chops.

ÒHeÕs one of the guys who could play on any drums and it would sound great. People will complain about his time or whatever, but theyÕd be missing the point ÐÐ itÕs the sound and the swing that he gets. That Brand X cut ÔNuclear BurnÕ is still one of the sickest fusion grooves, no oneÕs touched it. Sometimes IÕll be doing a soundcheck with Manson in some arena and IÕll pull out that beat out just for fun, and IÕll never know how to play it like he does.Ó

But then, rocker Jason had early on widened his palette for a vast array of musical modes, figuring rightly that he had at least a little something to learn from all of it.

ÒI started studying jazz and I got really into Art Taylor, on the more traditional side, which I could relate to. And then I got really into Jack DeJohnette, which kind of fucked me up, because thereÕs no way I could ever play like Jack DeJohnette; I mean, he has such elasticity, he could do a drum solo for 20 minutes and itÕs like a symphony.Ó

DeJohnetteÕs kaleidoscopic cymbal work made a particular impact.

ÒThatÕs one of the things that bridged me over to Paiste. DeJohnette devised all these dark Sound Creation cymbals that he used on everything, like that 22-inch China. Another drummer I really obsessed with who used those same cymbals was Al Foster, who played with Miles Davis on records like Man With the Horn and We Want Miles, great amalgams of heavy metal-meets-jazz. Miles didnÕt want Al to swing at all, but the dude has the most amazing swinging feel, and everything else was so creative; he would do a whole blues on a splash cymbal ÐÐ WhoÕd have thought of that?Ó

He cites Tony Williams as the blueprint for a long line of later jazz and rock greats.

ÒItÕs funny, but these dudes who have this kind of crazy chop feel, turning everything on its side and the beat is coming out of a place youÕd never imagine it coming from, their inspiration is Vinnie Colaiuta, and VinnieÕs inspiration was Tony Williams. ItÕs just Tony Williams all over again.Ó


Jason Sutter MATCHED GRIP IS FOR MONKEYS?
Like weÕve been saying, Jason Sutter is a rock drummer: What the hell use is traditional grip to a powerhouse pounder like him?

He laughs. ÒIn college it was always a joke, `Matched grip is for monkeys,Õ which is hilarious, Ôcause youÕd never hear that now. IÕd say 80-85 percent of all drummers play matched. But when I started studying jazz, I started getting into the traditional thing. Then when I got to college I got really heavily influenced by drum line and drum corps, again for the reason that I never had that growing up. I would play ÔYankee Doodle DandyÕ around the center town for Memorial Day once a year and that was it.Ó

From back in the day and on up to today, Sutter is intrigued by the rudiments of drumming.

ÒDrum corps was a mystery, I didnÕt know what it was. And when I got to music school in North Texas, it was such a big deal there, and I realized I donÕt know anything about this, and I became so involved. It was all traditional playing, and I literally still have callouses from the amount of time I held a marching drum stick in my hand.Ó

At North Texas, Sutter became totally obsessed with drum corps playing, focusing entirely on how to play marching snare drum. But when he got out of college he realized that trad grip is not the nicest thing to do to the top of the hand.

ÒIt wonÕt take the abuse, it wonÕt callous, itÕll always crack,Ó he says. ÒI practiced all the time, and it was just always bloody and open on the top of my hand between my thumb and index finger. But with matched grip, the callouses form on the inside of your hand.Ó

He does still play traditional occasionally, mostly for brushes, because it feels comfortable for him to be able to get that kind of side motion with his left hand. And in clinics heÕll pull out some drum corps snare drum solos and play a portion of that with traditional grip.


IÕVE BECOME A ROCK DRUMMER, THATÕS WHAT I DO
Sutter doesnÕt play the olÕ trad grip too much anymore mainly Ôcause heÕs evolved as a player ÐÐ head, hands and feet.

ÒIÕm at a point where, from studying jazz to playing with Marilyn Manson, and playing in big bands in college like my life depended on it, being able to sight read and then forgetting it all ÐÐ itÕs this process that just evolves. ItÕs like youÕre always just where you are, at that time, and where I am right now.Ó

And right now itÕs his feet thatÕre fascinating him most.

ÒWith drum corps, I spent so much time getting my hands to the pinnacle of where I thought they could be, and it was like, okay, IÕve seen the best and IÕm close, I can rest now. And while I still practice my hands everyday, now for me itÕs a foot thing: I never really did double-bass, did it for a little bit in high school and kind of tired of it quickly, said IÕm going to do it all on one bass drum.Ó

So far so good, but now this Manson gig is heavily double-bass-driven. And when Sutter was on tour with Chris Cornell, heÕd tried to play single-kick on tunes that Cornell had recorded with Timbaland that were heavily bass drum-programmed. It didnÕt work, just too damn difficult.

ÒSo I slowly started to add double-bass-drum into my playing, and it made a huge difference. I would start practicing double pedal and IÕd go out and hang with younger guys especially, Ôcause double bass has evolved so much from when I was younger, when Tommy Aldridge and Neal Peart reigned. I mean, they were amazing double-bass technicians, but nothing like whatÕs going on now.Ó

For a fresh perspective on the modern art of double-bassing, Sutter went to new-school sources like the Mars VoltaÕs Dave Elitch.

ÒI said, Show me what youÕre doing, give me your take on this. And I took what he showed me and applied it to my playing, and since then have been able to be on these tours with the best metal drummers in the world, from Dave Lombardo of Slayer to Chris Adler with Lamb of God, to Vinnie Paul from Pantera and Hellyeah, and Joey Jordison with Slipknot. Because weÕre playing the same stages with Manson, I sit five feet behind these guys, and IÕm learning so much from watching. ItÕs a whole Ônother art form.Ó

Double-kick technique is a way personal thing, he says, so whether heÕs playing heels up or down depends on the tempo, mostly, and to an extent the pedals themselves.

ÒI came back from tour, and I had these DW 5000 double pedals IÕve been using for 4-5 years, and I switched to some 9000s, and itÕs like the difference between Haydn and Mozart. And IÕve evolved to this other place where those pedals now are essential to what I need to do with Manson.Ó

On the new Marilyn Manson album Born Villain thereÕs a song called ÒMurderers Are Getting Prettier Every DayÓ that features some gruesomely complex drum patterns programmed by producer Chris Vrenna, who was originally slated to attempt to play drums on the record.

Sutter laughs. ÒChris said, ÔIÕll never be able to play this, itÕs physically impossible.Õ And when I was first auditioning for Manson, I was listening to this track and he said, ÔDonÕt worry, youÕll never have to play this, weÕll just have the tracks flown in and have you play along with the click ÐÐ I want you to be able to run around and chase girls after the show, I donÕt want your leg to be falling off.ÕÓ

Yeah, but Jason Sutter digs a challenge.

ÒI thought, if it takes hours and months and weeks, IÕm going to play this fuckinÕ song. And as soon as I got the gig, I would spend an extra hour a day practicing double bass. Well, so far weÕve done ÔMurdererÕ maybe four or five times, and itÕs an extra half hour that I warm up double-bass in my dressing room with these silent bass-drum warmup things called Hands and Foot Pedals. Then I go out onstage, and as the crewÕs testing basses and moving lights and mikes around, I practice the pedal, 16th notes at varying speeds. So IÕm practicing double bass for at least an hour a day before the show just to be able to play these tunes like this.Ó

As far as the band and its fans are concerned, Sutter is one of the best double-bass players theyÕve ever heard.

ÒMy joke is, IÕm completely fooling them [laughs], Ôcause itÕs still a new thing for me. IÕll never be as good as Joey Joderson or someone like that, Ôcause theyÕve spent years at it, but I will be close someday, and thatÕs the goal. Where IÕm at in my career, itÕs fun to have something to kind of go, All right, this is going to kick my ass for the next five years.Ó


IN THE MOUTH OF THE MACHINE
From Smashmouth to Vertical Horizon to Foreigner to New York Dolls to Chris Cornell and Marilyn Manson, SutterÕs basic ÒJohn BonhamÓ drum set (26-inch bass drum, a 14-inch rack tom, 16Ó and 18Ó cymbals) for live work is pretty much the same for just about everything he does. When he records he uses whateverÕs there, but for each job heÕll approach those drums individually, adding a different drum or cymbal here or there to create a particular kind of sound. Live and in studio with Manson, heÕs tasked with creating a ÒmechanicalÓ sound that will match a gnarly mass of triggered electronics and samples fed into the drum parts.

ÒThatÕs a whole new world IÕm having to become familiar with,Ó he says. ÒAll the drums have triggers on them, and itÕs blended in, and then IÕm playing along with tracks, count everything off. On tour, we have a giant refrigerator rig behind us with a drum tech whoÕs running all that. I start the tracks, but basically youÕre playing with a whole other instrument.Ó

He could really care less about the electronic side of the bandÕs sound, frankly, preferring to keep his head in the sand about all that. He relies on the sound man, on the front-of-house guy and his monitor tech to help his head break through the Manson bandÕs wall of noise.

ÒFor the monitor mix, though I need to basically just feel the drums, I always need to hear the taste of the snare drum ÐÐ the actual pitch of the snare balances everything out for me. But ultimately IÕve got to have MansonÕs voice in this gig, and the tracks and the click are pretty hot. WhatÕs great is, I have TwiggyÕs amps next to me to my left, and I have both guys in my mix, but not blasting. So now IÕm getting the sound of these guys from the stage, and itÕs great Ôcause thereÕs a lot of interaction and swing going on. IÕm not a slave to the grid.Ó

His time spent touring with Foreigner was an entirely different beast, soundwise.

ÒWith Foreigner, the monitor mix was all about Mick Jones. There were no drums at all, no clicks, guitar and bass blasting, and just Mick, every note. You wanna be right with him because heÕs a very elastic player, so youÕre going to have to ride that bull the whole night.Ó

Jones also favored a thuddy, vintage drum sound, so SutterÕs tuning couldnÕt go any lower; with Foreigner he used coated Ambassador heads that he had to change after every show ÐÐ ÒBecause theyÕre thin and just asking for itÓ ÐÐ and the snare was big and round and mushy.

With Manson Sutter plays on those black Remo heads that are famously a little bit dead ÐÐ all the better to muffle a trigger you might want to place on it.

ÒWith Manson itÕs more attack than tone,Ó he says, Òand theyÕre blending the trigger in anyway. But I still tune those drums up pretty high. When I say high, the bottom head is usually a third or half step or even a full step higher than the top head, and theyÕre both tuned pretty high.Ó


CLOSER TO THE SUN
When Sutter was touring with Foreigner, it was one of those gigs when theyÕd go out for a month and be home for a month. Pretty cushy, eh? Hold up: It seems that when Sutter was home on those breaks, he was practicing like mad, doing his double-bass and brushes and general technique, and doing drum clinics, too. So it was a very technical time for him, even though he was playing pretty simple rock tunes with Foreigner.

ÒAnd then I went out with the New York Dolls and it was like, Forget all that stuff. It was punky, snotty, raw, and I thought, IÕm just going to let that technical thing go. ItÕs a conscious effort to fight to get close to the sun and all that information, and then back off. I don't want to ever be too conscious and too proficient; what I get hired for is a feel.Ó

In other words, when you start to get too technical you veer toward Neal Peart, and when youÕre able to let all that go you can get back to your John Bonham.

ÒBut you can pull that Peart out if you need to,Ó he says. ÒAnd if you have that under your belt, it comes through in your playing without having to play it.Ó

Yeah, but in order to get to that special spot on the Peart-Bonham spectrum, youÕve gotta practice, which Sutter does every day when heÕs off the road.

ÒAnd honestly, I feel like IÕm constantly relearning how to play the drums. I never ever go in there and feel like ÔIÕm killing it now.Õ And when I play gigs and people are like, ÔDude, youÕre killing it!Õ IÕm like, ÔYeah, IÕm not even close.ÕÓ


YOU WANT IT, WORK FOR IT

ÒI remember going to college and itÕs a vacation and I stayed and practiced. ThereÕs no one around and IÕm practicing and IÕm like, What the hell am I doing? Am I going to be doing this in 10 years? And then 10 years later IÕm in a practice room at 11 at night to play for three hours, and IÕm going, Am I going to keep doing this shit? Am I ever going to get good enough to just be done?Ó

The answer, it seems, is NO!

ÒIÕm always going to be evolving. And you can tie it in with the drum corps stuff and all that. I was willing to temporarily sacrifice drum set, which was my passion, knowing it would be a means to getting me somewhere else down the road. And it did ÐÐ I got a scholarship next year to go to North Texas Ôcause I could play snare drum! How? I lived, ate and drank it. I didnÕt play in any rock bands, I didnÕt hang out with chicks, I went and fuckinÕ did drum corps work every day at 8 and got my ass kicked. And it was awesome.Ó











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